Contaminated fuel anyone?

Submitted: Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 10:36
ThreadID: 72924 Views:8446 Replies:12 FollowUps:13
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Over the past three months I've picked up contaminated diesel from two servos...one in Kempsey NSW and the other in Nowra NSW. The first was water contamination and thankfully the expensive fuel filter on my D40 pick it up early and allowed me to deal with it. The second contamination was water and lots of brown goop that looked awfully like 'diesel bug'. Again the fuel filter did its job and alerted me before any engine damage could be done. Drained and fulshed the tanks and all points aft of the filter.
This is getting to be a bit of an expensive excercise - $184 for new filter each time (yep that's right folks this filter comes with all the electrics in a sealed unit), $150-$200 of diesel (I have a 160 ltr tank), one hour labour and disposal cost of about $120. And, apart from these cost I want to protect my engine from incurring any serious damage.

Done a bit of a search on other forums eg Prado, NewHilux etc, where the vehicles come with common rail engines and thus far haven't found a solution. That's notwithstanding that quite a number of these engines have cost their owners from $7000 to $12000 for fuel system repairs (pumps, injectors, common rail etc) following ingestion of contaminated fuel.

Now I know we should expect to be getting clean fuel each time we refule but it is quite obvious that this is not the case and it is equally obvious that the oil companies won't fess up in a hurry to dispensing contaminated fuel. I figure if we can't rely on clean storage/dispensing systems then we have to do something to ensure we protect ourselves.

So, I've been doing a bit of research and have decided that in future that I will run the first 10-20 ltrs from any bowser though a funnel to check for contamination and then if all is clear fill the tank directly from the bowser. I found a filter (on the advice of a friend who is into flying light aircraft and ultralights) that seems to be ideally suited to the task. I have bought a Mr Funnel filter that is capable of handling 45 ltrs/min and intend using this on each fill from now on.

Just in case anyone is interested you can read about the Mr Funnel at this link. I also bought a carry bag for the funnel from a country Victoria supplier Punkinhead Airsports. The funnel can be bought at any reputable diesel centre. Also BCF stocks them here in Canberra.

I realise that it is best to fill at the same servo all the time and I do this when home but I do a lot of travelling and figure that this thing will pay for itself....after all it is cheaper than just one of my OEM fuel filters.
Been thinking that the first time I get dirty fuel in this filter I will take the evidence into the servo immediately and depending on the response I get....maybe even tip the contents on the counter.......but then again I'm a bit of a softy so probably couldn't do that to the poor unsuspecting counter staff.

Sorry for the length of this post but thought others might be interested in my solution to this problem. I would be interested in finding out how others protect themselves from the possibility of taking on contaminated fuel.

Disclaimer: I'm a shiny bum public servant nearing retirement and have no commercial interest in either Mr Funnel or Punkinhead Air Sports just a strong desire to try and save myself from the problems of taking on contaminated diesel.
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Reply By: racinrob - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 12:25

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 12:25
I do a lot of outback travel and buy fuel in obscure places and every so often have copped a tank full of contaminated fuel. I fitted an after market CAV filter and sediment bowl set up to my Toyota 1HZ diesel and while this is not 100% effective it has certainly saved me from pump damage etc. The CAV filter elements I buy by the dozen at about $6.00 each and change with every oil change at 5,000 kms, it certainly works out cheaper than the genuine Toyota fuel filter at about $70.00 + each.
People say to me, "Don't buy discount diesel or bio-diesel" but there is no guarantee on what comes out of the nozzle where ever you buy.
My diesel mechanic says always buy one brand, pay by card and keep your receipts....

Rob.
AnswerID: 386585

Follow Up By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 12:35

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 12:35
usually use Woolworths or Coles Servos but sometimes its not possible.

Therefore look for the busiest, working on the theory sell more fresher fuel.

In small places a bit hard I admit as I got a bad lot around Tom Price and car

blew black smoke all over front of van and gas bottles.


Never did it before and hasnt done it again after running it out and refilling at next stop.
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Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:03

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:03
Graham H - me too in regards to using Coles or Woolies - and high turnover outlets. Without naming names I didn't change my choice of servo in both the cases of contaminated fuel I picked up.

racinrob - Yeah had a CAV on my old patrol but unfortunately these cannot be fitted to the new common rail engines. Pressures in the rail can exceed 20000psi and this can be affected by extra inline filters. I understand that CRDI engines have a habbit of going into limp home mode when the ECU senses restrictions. I believe that CAV and other are working on a solution.
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Follow Up By: mazcan barry - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:33

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:33
hi
yes had a tank full from tom price in 2002 that blew black smoke with loss of power and fuel in bowl had a strange brownish colour until all gone

and 2 months ago filled my auxillary tank at mandurah w/w and the exhaust fumes are dead spit of power kerosene
and i should know as used 2 tractors for years running on it

but i rely on after market filters and bowl and water trap near tank that was standard equipt on mazda it's hard to get any supplier to admit to supplying dirty fuel and they know yr only a little guy but i'm not suggesting we turn a blind eye either
the mr funnel sounds like a smart move to me after all when we got our fuel delivered in refillable drums many years ago funnels where all the go but yeh we are in 2009 now or are we???????
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Follow Up By: mazcan barry - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:51

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:51
each time i change a fuel filter i cut the old one open and peel it apart to see what it has trapped the one ex tom price event was full of rusty water that way if your buying fuel from regular outlets you then decide to cotinue or try else where but no guarantee that you dont get more dirt but of couse if your cintually moving on around can only be evidence???
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Follow Up By: fisho64 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 17:14

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 17:14
The CAV filter goes in the lines before the engine not the fuel rail. Hence 20000 psi isnt in the filter canister.
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Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 17:25

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 17:25
Yep agree entirely fisho64....wasn't suggesting otherwise. What I was trying to point out is that you simply cannot use them with a common rail engine..not because of the high presssure per se but rather they inhibit the free flow of fuel to the high pressure side of the system...if that makes sense. The CAV is a great piece of kit...but not for a common rail engine.
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Reply By: Member - Allan B (QLD) - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:53

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 13:53
Patrol22, This is good info.

I take it that you only run the first 10-20 litres through the funnel due to a slowed flow capacity. How much does it slow the fill flow-rate? 50% of usual pump rate, or what?

What size Punkinhead carry bag suits the funnel, small, medium or large?

Of course the good habits of fuel source go down the drain when you are in the bush. This could be good insurance.

Cheers
Allan

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AnswerID: 386594

Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 14:26

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 14:26
Alan - I bought the 45 ltr/min Mr Funnel and this just about keeps up with the slow flow diesel pumps. Was thinking that after 10-20 ltrs if there was no gunk in the funnel then it would be safe to fill the remainder from the bowser directly. But then again..........

The large Punkinhead carry bag is suited to the 45 ltr/min funnel and the next one down in flow rate as well.

I forgot to mention that dependin on how your fuel tank is set up you may need to manufacture an extension piece for the funnel. I just went to a local supplier and bought a length of flexible clear hose that was diesel compatible.
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Reply By: Member - Josh (VIC) - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 14:48

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 14:48
We have used Mr funnel filters a bit on our travels. One point to note is that some water can bypass the filter if the fuel is mixed/shaken up before being put through the filter. It is interesting though what shows up in the fuel when put through the filter. Console operators can get upset when you take a bit of time to filter the fuel and check the filter before filling up properly but if you find stuff in the filter afterwards they shut up real quick lol. When I fueled up in out of the way places I would often put fuel in the jerry can and allow it to sit for a minute before putting it through the filter later when needed. I do the same as you do, check first 10-20 ltrs then if ok fill it up normally.

Josh
AnswerID: 386600

Reply By: flashcher - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 18:13

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 18:13
Hi Patrol22,
I have a transport company in Nowra and rely on diesel to keep the truck running.
Without naming names, is there any chance you could give my a clue on where to steer clear of?
Thanks in advance,
Michelle
AnswerID: 386626

Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 18:52

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 18:52
On North StreeT Michelle
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Follow Up By: flashcher - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 21:53

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 21:53
Thanks Patrol22.
I know the place in question and have heard similar reports about the petrol, but not diesel.
A later post made a point that this sometimes happens with servo's with low turnover, but I can assure that the one in mention has a high turnover all the time.
Cheers, Michelle
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Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 22:46

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 22:46
Yeah filled up there knowing of its high turnover. Like Axle says below though none of the oil companies would deliver contaminated fuel - the problem is purely one of storage. Not simple or cheap to resolve but surely some sort of filtration system could be added to pumps.
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Reply By: Member - Axle - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 19:04

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 19:04
G/Day patrol 22 , Contamination in fuel Is....Has always been a problem in areas that have slow volume sales,or old storage tanks!, It goes hand in hand, I would be very surprised if a Tanker from any reptuable fuel company would deliver contaminated fuel to a outlet, I know of one servo at a area where the tanks could hold only 50% of there capacity the rest was water,( Diesel sits on top of water} and nothing was done about it as the servo was to be demolished in the near future,You might notice as the take over from the giants goes on, the old get replaced with new building, and storage tanks!

Unfortunately the modern hi Tech diesel motor has very litte tolerance to dirty fuel, if any, !filters are the thing you have to keep changing and a clear bowl sediment trap close to the tank is always a good guide to monitor how things are going, My opinion only.

Cheers Axle.
AnswerID: 386636

Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 22:49

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 22:49
Agree Axle but these were both high turn over stations and the latter has been rebuilt in recent times. Reckon the only way to be sure of getting uncontaminated fuel it so filter on the way from the bowser to my tank...and this I intend to do until such time as servos install some sort of final filtration system to their bowsers. Guess I be doing this for a long time then eh:-)
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Reply By: Dave(NSW) - Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 23:23

Sunday, Oct 11, 2009 at 23:23
Hi Patrol22,
How long ago was the bad fuel in Kempsey & was the servo on the Hwy nth bound or south bound.
Cheers Dave...
GU RULES!!

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AnswerID: 386664

Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 07:18

Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 07:18
1st week of September Dave. LHS southbound on the northside of town.
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Reply By: obee1212 - Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 10:04

Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 10:04
Contaminated fuel is not the only way to get water in the tank. Condensation comes in with the air that replaces the fuel as it leaves the tank. This in turn provides a habitat for fungus that thrives on dieseline.

I run some fuel additive from time to time as a precaution and I have not had a problem since twenty years ago. This is not to say it is a cure for putting a water fuel mix in from a bowser but if you get a dose from this source, using some additive after draining water from tank and filter will help to get the last bits out.

For all my opinion is worth anyway.

Owen.
AnswerID: 386683

Reply By: Ted G - Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 18:58

Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 18:58
Hi All
I posted a note some months ago about bad Diesel from Dickson ACT Woolworths since then I have only used Shell fuel all the way up to Cooktown and back present at 1770 no problems.
getting reasonable fuel consumption towing 18ft 6 caravan and no loss of power compared to Woolworths.
will nether use Woolworths or Caltex fuel again.
Regards
Ted
AnswerID: 386735

Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 19:19

Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 19:19
Ted - I too prefer shell fuel and use this whenever I can. Unfortunately the dirty I took on in Kempsey was shell. Will, however, continue to use shell here from my supplier in Fyshwick.
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Reply By: drowned_rat - Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 19:41

Monday, Oct 12, 2009 at 19:41
There is an Australian standard for Diesel fuel and it doesn't include very much water in it at all. They have an obligation to supply you with good quality fuel.

Australian fuel standards for Diesel fuel

If you get bad fuel from a supplier have a chat to them about getting them to pay for the removal, disposal and replacement of the bad fuel, filters etc. Failing that, have a chat to your state based automobile club or if you are a member of a 4wd club, have a chat to them for advice. I have seen the servo's foot bills over $3,000 for injector pump rebuilds after supplying bad fuel.
AnswerID: 386743

Reply By: Member - Richard H (NSW) - Tuesday, Oct 13, 2009 at 09:51

Tuesday, Oct 13, 2009 at 09:51
A number of years ago I was responsible for the operation of a number of FWD vehicles, Nissan & Toyota's.

At one centre in this district one of our vehicle refuelled from a diesel pump, and made it for about 50 metres and conked out.

The vehicle had to be recovered and went to the agent, who found that the fuel tank contained a lot of water. This had gone into the injector pump and done severe damage, necessitating replacement. Though the vehicle was under warranty this was refused as it was considered 'pilot error'.

So we went after the fuel dealer, who tried to play duck and drakes, claiming that the vehicle had picked up bad fuel elsewhere. This was quickly discounted by the volume obtained, the tanks were almost on empty, and received almost the amount specified in the service book as being the tanks capacity.

After threats of legal action he came to the party, it cost him $1400.

What I reckoned happened is this: There was a lot of exploratory work being undertaken in the district by teams who were out bush, and had fuel delivered in 44's. Those drums not used were recovered and instead of having them filtered, as I believe they should be, though this costs, the diesel had been syphoned back into one of the below ground tanks. As we had some serious rain prior to this I think the drums were contaminated when on site, and being greedy, the dealer did the wrong thing.

We were lucky as the dealer was in the town where the vehicle was attached, and they had only gone a very short distance before it conked out. So the denials fell a bit flat.

Personally, when travelling I carry four jerries of diesel that I get filled at Woolies Caltex or the larger outlets. I tip them into the vehicle, through a good funnel & filter, so that any crap that is received is held in the can. I don't syphon. No worries as yet, touch wood!

AnswerID: 386848

Reply By: Member - Mike DID - Tuesday, Oct 13, 2009 at 20:20

Tuesday, Oct 13, 2009 at 20:20
"quite a number of these engines have cost their owners from $7000 to $12000 for fuel system repairs (pumps, injectors, common rail etc) following ingestion of contaminated fuel. "

- this is why refuelling takes me a bit longer these days. I firstly pump some fuel into a glass jar and check for contamination before I put fuel in the tank.
If the bubbles rise, it's just air - if the bubbles fall it's water.

I have six jars so I always have samples of the last 5 tankfuls.

If the dealer tells me that any engine problems are due to contaminated fuel, I'll have samples as evidence of which (IF ANY !) servo had contaminated fuel.

It's already saved me taking on water in the Diesel - from a BP on the Cumberland Hwy southbound from the F3 just after some rain !
AnswerID: 386919

Reply By: TotalPM - Wednesday, Oct 14, 2009 at 22:17

Wednesday, Oct 14, 2009 at 22:17
I sympathise with your contaminated fuel scenario. I never fill my tanks without Pro-Ma fuel additive. It has saved me from the expensive problems you have experienced. I buy it online from www.fueladditive.com.au. I hope this helps you.
AnswerID: 387101

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